defiantspurr
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Post by defiantspurr on Dec 6, 2018 18:23:30 GMT
Was having an interesting discusidis with Jester , but the shitbox is no place for a convo, posts get missed etc. So I though I would start a thread on climate change.
As a scientist I am open to changes in data, and do change my opinion based on the data and evidence provided by my peers.
Also in case of was getting some caching error and not seeing the articles you were linking correctly, a thread is a better place to post them ๐
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defiantspurr
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Post by defiantspurr on Dec 6, 2018 18:44:43 GMT
And yes I picked a trollish title on purpose ๐
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defiantspurr
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Post by defiantspurr on Dec 6, 2018 18:56:49 GMT
Just to get some bits out of the way to help make it all flow better. I don't see this as political. I am purely interested in the climate change phenomena and its impact on the species of the planet. Obviously I have a professional obligation to be concerned about the welfare and future of animals and humans. But that does not preclude me from changing my position as data and theory are updated.
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ZER01025
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Post by ZER01025 on Dec 6, 2018 19:34:43 GMT
So did you read the report that came out on black friday? I breifly skimmed it but from what I read I'm glad I'll he dead by 2100. Even if we somehow figure out global warming, we'll overpopulate and overconsume soon enough.
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Snorelacks
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Post by Snorelacks on Dec 6, 2018 19:41:13 GMT
I've spent a lot of time reading on this stuff and trying to see both sides of the coin. I also believe climate change is real as it has been for thousands of millennia. There have been 13 ice ages on a 100,000 year cycle (from 1.25 million years ago to the present, and 33 ice ages on a 41,000 year cycle (between 2.6 million and 1.25 million years ago). We are now living in the coldest period of Earthโs history for the last 65 million years, but you won't hear that from people. Even if we cease all emissions completely, the climate will still change and our current โrecord heatwaveโ is far cooler than normal. The dinosaurs would have told us to fuck off: โWhat? You think this shit is warm?"
Temperatures are only considered to be increasing if viewed for the last 150 years, from 1850 onward which is roughly when thermometers began collecting global data and is also the period of time the UNโs Climate Change Panel conveniently chose for their review and the period where scientists have been caught manipulating data (multiple times). There are far more examples of all the prognostications by "the experts" that haven't even come close to coming true than there are of anything remotely being proven true regarding warming temps caused by man that are outside of the norms for temperature/ice shelf fluctuations prior to man or prior to any form of industry.
That said, I do think we need to be good stewards of our earth and mitigate waste, pollution and invest in cleaner energy. Just not at the expense of the poor, middle class or countries that are trying to modernize enough to experience their industrial revolution so to speak. The riots in France are perfect example of this misguided approach...slap a 9% fuel tax increase that disproportionately affects the poor, middle class and suburban/rural citizens. Seems fair.
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ZER01025
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Post by ZER01025 on Dec 6, 2018 19:45:45 GMT
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Snorelacks
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Post by Snorelacks on Dec 6, 2018 21:11:38 GMT
So did you read the report that came out on black friday? I breifly skimmed it but from what I read I'm glad I'll he dead by 2100. Even if we somehow figure out global warming, we'll overpopulate and overconsume soon enough. All of us will be dead by then Zero so don't feel like the Lone Ranger. If it's any consolation, there's a pretty good chance that most of those predictions won't happen. After all, James Hansen the top NASA scientist (to some the father of the Global Warming movement) stood before Congress in 1988 and predicted that we were well on our way to being the new Atlantis and our atmosphere was going to be an EZBake Oven by 2018. He ended up being the Bernie Madoff of the Global Warming pseudo-religion (now it's called Climate Change).
Al Gore is another enlightened one with all kinds of input from the best of the best when it comes to climate scientists- Go back and look at his 10 predictions from "An Inconvenient Truth", remember the 2006 movie that won him an Oscar and a Nobel Prize...not one of them has come true. But hey, he get's $175,000 speaking fees, is tied to at least fourteen green-tech firms, sits strategically on multiple boards, benefited from Obama grants and millions in tax breaks. Heโs on his way to becoming our first carbon billionaire.
It's also a good thing these expert predictions from the 1970 Earth Day didn't come true either-
- "Civilization will end within 15 or 30 years unless immediate action is taken against problems facing mankind." โ Harvard biologist George Wald
- "Population will inevitably and completely outstrip whatever small increases in food supplies we make. The death rate will increase until at least 100-200 million people per year will be starving to death during the next ten years." โ Stanford University biologist Paul Ehrlich
- "Most of the people who are going to die in the greatest cataclysm in the history of man have already been bornโฆ [By 1975] some experts feel that food shortages will have escalated the present level of world hunger and starvation into famines of unbelievable proportions. Other experts, more optimistic, think the ultimate food-population collision will not occur until the decade of the 1980s." โ Paul Ehrlich
- "Demographers agree almost unanimously on the following grim timetable: by 1975 widespread famines will begin in India; these will spread by 1990 to include all of India, Pakistan, China and the Near East, Africa. By the year 2000, or conceivably sooner, South and Central America will exist under famine conditionsโฆ. By the year 2000, thirty years from now, the entire world, with the exception of Western Europe, North America, and Australia, will be in famine." โ North Texas State University professor Peter Gunter
- "In a decade, urban dwellers will have to wear gas masks to survive air pollutionโฆ by 1985 air pollution will have reduced the amount of sunlight reaching earth by one half." โ Life magazine
- "At the present rate of nitrogen buildup, it's only a matter of time before light will be filtered out of the atmosphere and none of our land will be usable." โ Ecologist Kenneth Watt
- "Air pollution...is certainly going to take hundreds of thousands of lives in the next few years alone." โ Paul Ehrlich
- "By the year 2000, if present trends continue, we will be using up crude oil at such a rateโฆ that there won't be any more crude oil. You'll drive up to the pump and say, โFill 'er up, buddy,' and he'll say, โI am very sorry, there isn't any.'" โ Ecologist Kenneth Watt
- "[One] theory assumes that the earth's cloud cover will continue to thicken as more dust, fumes, and water vapor are belched into the atmosphere by industrial smokestacks and jet planes. Screened from the sun's heat, the planet will cool, the water vapor will fall and freeze, and a new Ice Age will be born." โ Newsweek magazine
- "The world has been chilling sharply for about twenty years. If present trends continue, the world will be about four degrees colder for the global mean temperature in 1990, but eleven degrees colder in the year 2000. This is about twice what it would take to put us into an ice age." โ Kenneth Watt
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Shhhhh
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Post by Shhhhh on Dec 7, 2018 2:30:45 GMT
Oh how I love these topics
Remember no matter what research says, either for or against the global warming movement there is one fact that remains and cannot be debated.
The Earth, at some point will cease to be able to support life as we know it in any shape or form. It's not an if, it's a when. It maybe thousands or millions of years from now, but at some point the whole debate will be moot.
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Post by R35T NO MORE on Dec 7, 2018 10:50:39 GMT
I wanted to see a communist polar bear:(
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defiantspurr
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Post by defiantspurr on Dec 7, 2018 11:03:01 GMT
Oh how I love these topics Remember no matter what research says, either for or against the global warming movement there is one fact that remains and cannot be debated. The Earth, at some point will cease to be able to support life as we know it in any shape or form. It's not an if, it's a when. It maybe thousands or millions of years from now, but at some point the whole debate will be moot. Yup. And some species human intervention can never save. Everything ends
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Post by Valkyrie on Dec 9, 2018 20:13:54 GMT
Iirc,the Earth has about 1 billion years left for the most part, complex life will be destroyed not by anything other than the Sun maturing in to a later stage of it's life.
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Snorelacks
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Post by Snorelacks on Dec 9, 2018 22:21:07 GMT
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test777777
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Post by test777777 on Dec 10, 2018 7:03:38 GMT
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